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In EN, the word "work" comes from "do." In FR, "torture." Think about the difference in perspective. I do. It comes up as a US leftist in France, trying to communicate my ideas. In Pravic (I recently finished The Dispossessed by Ursula K. LeGuin), same word for work & play. In Ecotopia, the protagonist remarked on how work and play seemed to go hand in hand. Think on that. It's a koan, maybe.
#leftism #ursulakleguin #buddhism #english #french #etymology #koan #thedispossessed #ecotopia #zen
#english #etymology #leftism #buddhism #zen #french #ursulakleguin #TheDispossessed #ecotopia #koan

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Lorraine Lee
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Lorraine Lee
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I think the French are on to something with that work as torture concept. According to Christianity, the necessity of livelihood is part of God's way of punishing us for original disobedience, so it rings true.

I very much enjoyed The Dispossessed, particularly the idea of the "Division Of Labor". I also liked the "Job Guarantee" as described in Doctorow's book Lost Cause.

in reply to Lorraine Lee

donthatedontkill
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donthatedontkill
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@lori I don't really agree with the French, at least in so much that work has to be torture or punishment. I think what I was trying to get at is that we should start dreaming of a society where work is not intrinsically torture.

I haven't heard of the lost cause. I'll have to check it out!

@Lorraine Lee
in reply to donthatedontkill

Kris Dreemurr (they/them) of the Pnictogen Wing
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Kris Dreemurr (they/them) of the Pnictogen Wing
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honestly I think the "work = torture" folks had the better idea. "work = play" has become a staple of the worst sort of toxic U.S. management and entrepreneurial culture ~Chara
in reply to Kris Dreemurr (they/them) of the Pnictogen Wing

donthatedontkill
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donthatedontkill
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@kris_of_pnictogen Of course anyone who tells you work, as we conceive of it today, is play is bullshitting you. But the point of bringing some fictional societies into the discussion is to show maybe there are other ways we could conceive of work. To think and redo work in which it's no longer work really. I think humans like to do things. No one enjoys idleness unless they're tired (in which case they're probably resting, which if work is doing, it's also work... They're doing something).
@Kris Dreemurr (they/them) of the Pnictogen Wing
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Juha Autero
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Juha Autero
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@kris_of_pnictogen What we call work is a result of industrialisation. Basically all work is factory work. That's why we have employers, daily working hours, working days, workplace, salaries and capitalism. Industrial society is (only) couple hundred years old. There is no reason to believe it will exist in 200 years.
I firmly believe industrial age will end in this century. Either we build something better and move to post-industrial society...
@Kris Dreemurr (they/them) of the Pnictogen Wing
in reply to Juha Autero

donthatedontkill
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donthatedontkill
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@jautero @kris_of_pnictogen Exactly. The way I feel about it is that we're going to move into something new pretty soon and we need to start thinking about what we want that to be because other people with less than solidaire intentions have a very clear picture of what they would like.
@Juha Autero @Kris Dreemurr (they/them) of the Pnictogen Wing

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